First off-road since I swap my 890R For T700

[Stou]

I don't really miss my 890R. The T7 is less powerfull but who really need 105HP on off-road!

 

https://youtu.be/wBvKF0XWQHc?si=OFdlBhinJ7QfaTFG

[Windblown]

I too like the T700 a bunch but I'm still trying to adapt to the ergos when standing.  The foot pegs sit so much further back on Euro bikes and that makes maintaining a neutral position while standing and accelerating or climbing hills much easier for me.  In all other ways the T700 is a gem now that I have a good suspension under it.  

 

You make any changes to the ergos? How tall are you and what's your inseam if I may ask? 

Edited July 14 by Windblown

[Stou]

12 hours ago, Windblown said:

I too like the T700 a bunch but I'm still trying to adapt to the ergos when standing.  The foot pegs sit so much further back on Euro bikes and that makes maintaining a neutral position while standing and accelerating or climbing hills much easier for me.  In all other ways the T700 is a gem now that I have a good suspension under it.  

 

You make any changes to the ergos? How tall are you and what's your inseam if I may ask? 

I'm 5'10', inseam around 35".  I only adjusted the handlebar to my taste. On my 890R I always end-up with pain in the back and the knees, no mather what I tried to adjust. The only thing that helped a little bit was the rally seat. It helped for the knees pain on long rides. On the T7 everything is good as it is. No more back or knees pain.

[Windblown]

2 hours ago, Stou said:

I'm 5'10', inseam around 35".  I only adjusted the handlebar to my taste. On my 890R I always end-up with pain in the back and the knees, no mather what I tried to adjust. The only thing that helped a little bit was the rally seat. It helped for the knees pain on long rides. On the T7 everything is good as it is. No more back or knees pain.

 

Yep. the T700 is fine for me while sitting. The seat to peg distance is better than on the 790/890 and very welcome. It's just when it comes to standing in technical terrain that I have trouble getting a comfortable stance on it. On the 790 a taller seat helped the sitting position and lower pegs opened up the seat to peg a bit more.  I did swap out the handlebars on the 790 in about the first 3 days of ownership as I really disliked the sweep. Now it feels absolutely natural. I just haven't gotten quite there with the T700 yet. 

[Stou]

How tall are you?

[Windblown]

39 minutes ago, Stou said:

How tall are you?

 

6' and around a 33" inseam.

Edited July 14 by Windblown

[Stou]

Did you tried to push your handlebar forward like we do in trial? It has a similar effect as riser. But not as far as the one in this video. It can be uncomfortable on the road.

 

https://youtu.be/bCjALyKNvyM?si=3H42-ejE0KIEIZxD

[Windblown]

2 hours ago, Stou said:

Did you tried to push your handlebar forward like we do in trial? It has a similar effect as riser. But not as far as the one in this video. It can be uncomfortable on the road.

 

https://youtu.be/bCjALyKNvyM?si=3H42-ejE0KIEIZxD

 

 

Thanks. I'm not a big fan of rotating bars forward much past the forks plane simply because of what it can do to the grip area angle (making it sweep up).  I have the bars rise in the same plane as the forks currently. I did reverse the riser block which moved the handlebars a bit more forward which helps. Between that and the pegs getting nudged back I'm pretty close to where I want to be.  The bars don't feel too low, just a bit close when standing.  The standing ergos remind me of a Honda CRF250R I had once. I ended up selling it and picking up a 250XC-F which instantly solved the problem  for me but that's not going to happen with the T700. I like this bike way to much.

[Windblown]

@Stou Just wanted to say thanks for getting me mulling over the ergo differences more as it is a burr under the saddle for me!

 

As I mentioned in the earlier posts the ergos just feel a bit off when standing and slightly stretched out when sitting on the T700 for me compared to my 790-R setup which really irks me because it's a stumbling block to making it easy to opt to take the T700 rather than the 790-R every time I head out to ride offroad.   I really want to nail down what the differences actually really were to see how much were physical and how much were my imagination. So... I broke out a tape measure, plumb bob, & level and with the bikes on stands set to taking measurements to compare them. Here is what I found (and again neither bike is stock with it comes to ergos now. Both have after market pegs, seats, and on the KTM handlebars. 

 

Here are the results (stock Yamaha image grabbed from web):

 

So at least I wasn't imagining the differences.

 

Distance between points	Yamaha	KTM
Top of grip to top of peg (Vertical)	35"	33"
Back of grip to front of peg (horizontal)	17"	18.5"
Distance from seat to grip (horizontal)	16.0"	14.5"
Summary: Yamaha bars are 2" higher and 1.5" closer horizontally to the pegs compared to my 790-R.

 

 

I can adapt to the differences to a degree but I think I will continue to try to get the ergos better.   The more stretched out/reaching forward feeling while seated  I can live with though don't want to increase it any more than it is. The bigger issue is when standing is having the bars about 1.5" closer and 1.5" higher on the Yamaha. and the large difference in feel that creates.  Getting a handlebar with less rise would lower the bars and effectively move them forward a bit more but my seated position stretch would become more extreme and not sure that will work as  I'm a sit when you can and stand when you have to kind of rider so sitting ergos matter too.

 

I am going to try to shift the pegs back a bit more. Maybe try to hunt down a footpeg bracket that shift the pegs back. Either that or I may have to breakdown and get steg pegz, but I'm resisting that at the moment.  

 

I know it wasn't the intent of your post for me to take this side track on it but thanks anyway! 

Edited July 17 by Windblown

[Hollybrook]

@Windblown another option to consider is Bosley pegs.  Radan makes them to order and can most likely give you exactly what you want.  

[Windblown]

54 minutes ago, Hollybrook said:

@Windblown another option to consider is Bosley pegs.  Radan makes them to order and can most likely give you exactly what you want.  

 

That's a possibility.  I've run their custom pegs previously on a couple of different bikes and they are bomber and being custom is awesome.   My one small gripe on their pegs I've had for other models is they pushed my feet out from the bike a bit compared to other pegs. Not sure if that would be the case on the T700 though.  I'll keep them in mind! Thanks for the reminder of them.

 

In the meantime I did locate a source for some offset footpeg brackets this morning that lower and move the peg to the rear.  They probably won't be quite as strong when it comes to hits from below as the OEM mounts since the mounting bolts are offset rather than inline with the peg mount but I try not to eat dirt as much these days as I used to so that might not be much of a factor. We'll see... 

Edited July 17 by Windblown

[DT675]

Thats very interesting Windblown.  Im not sure how close your 790R is to a new '24 890R but while riding one of those lately I hated the foot peg height-to-seat distance.  It felt like a sport bike compared to my T7.  But I loved the handlebar height and reach-to-seat distance.  It was very comfortable to me while my T7 has the farthest reach handlebars of any bike ive ever been on, but your saying you need more reach distance?   I put bar backs on mine to help bring my reach closer in even though I didnt need the additional height.  I wonder if one could put bar backs on backwards.  Other than an upsidedown logo I dont see why not.

[Hollybrook]

6 hours ago, Windblown said:

 

That's a possibility.  I've run their custom pegs previously on a couple of different bikes and they are bomber and being custom is awesome.   My one small gripe on their pegs I've had for other models is they pushed my feet out from the bike a bit compared to other pegs. Not sure if that would be the case on the T700 though.  I'll keep them in mind! Thanks for the reminder of them.

My Bosley pegs are 30mm down and 20mm back, and they do push your feet out about an inch.  I kind of like that on the right side, as I am no longer bothered by the clutch pivot hitting my leg.

[Windblown]

7 hours ago, DT675 said:

Thats very interesting Windblown.  Im not sure how close your 790R is to a new '24 890R but while riding one of those lately I hated the foot peg height-to-seat distance.  It felt like a sport bike compared to my T7.  But I loved the handlebar height and reach-to-seat distance.  It was very comfortable to me while my T7 has the farthest reach handlebars of any bike ive ever been on, but your saying you need more reach distance?   I put bar backs on mine to help bring my reach closer in even though I didnt need the additional height.  I wonder if one could put bar backs on backwards.  Other than an upsidedown logo I dont see why not.

 

I also love the additional distance between the pegs and seat compared to the 790 in stock form. The 790 is quite tight, and almost "sportbike like" as you mentioned.  

 

As for the handlebars - I'm saying I want more reach when standing, I don't need any more reach while seated.  While the reach to the bars on the stock T700 while seated is slightly further and less dirt bike like than on the 790 I find it completely manageable. But the reverse happens when standing and that's all due to the differences in peg postion in the forward/backward plane. I have been fighting the more forward peg position of the T700.  Addressing the differences in ergos while standing thru the handlebars was primarily because moving handlebar position thru adjustments or different bars is extremely easy to achieve.  Moving pegs is more limited and involves making changes to shift and brake levers which is sometimes limited. So moving the handlebars forward a bit was simply a means to an end to open things up while standing on the T700.

 

The problem with trying to address a peg position issue thru the handlebars is that if the handlebars feel good when seated but feel off when standing making changes to improve the standing position can make the seated position feel worse, and vice-versa.  

 

The more reward peg position on the 790 allows for the rider to be in a balanced neutral feeling standing attack position (not having to pull or push on the bars for balance) with the riders body further back from the bars .  A more forward peg position moves the entire body closer to the bars for the same neutral feeling  position. Depending ones body dimensions this can be a good thing, or a bad thing.   

 

They say a picture is worth a thousand words so I took two.    With a level sitting directly over the footpeg and plumb front to back on the two bikes it's pretty easy to see the more forward position of the pegs on the T700 and even more plain to see the difference in how the bars would feel between sitting and standing between the two bikes by looking at where the level intersects the seats on the bikes.  Not saying one is right and the other wrong but the resulting feel to the rider is very different and I'm a bit partial to the standing feel on the KTM.  Anyway, it will be interesting to see if getting the pegs back a little bit further will get me where I'd like to be without compromising the actual handlebar position further. Hindsight being 20/20 I should have made my own thread on this...

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 17 by Windblown

[DT675]

Wow, that is a significant difference between the 2!  It also explains why I felt the way I felt/feel on each.  It explains why i feel the T7 is such a far reach while siting down, but not standing.

 

I definitely sit well behind the pegs/ your level on the T7 and closer to inline with the level on the KTM.  Interesting, thanks for sharing.